Genesis The Podcast

Healing the Healers: Fostering Resilience in Caregivers and Therapists in a World of Relentless Trauma

• Genesis Women's Shelter & Support

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Ever wondered how those who help others manage their own well-being amidst the chaos? Licensed professional counselor Aubrey Richardson joins us to share her journey from researcher at Johns Hopkins University to providing care in clinical settings across Texas. She highlights her mission, focusing on helping therapists, caregivers, and healthcare professionals navigate the challenges of perfectionism, people-pleasing, and burnout, particularly as amplified by the shared trauma of the COVID-19 pandemic. Aubrey's approach emphasizes holistic healing and advocates for a balanced life in a world that often glorifies relentless hustle.

The conversation takes a thoughtful exploration into the evolving landscape for healthcare professionals in a post-pandemic world, where mental health services face soaring demand. We shine a light on the necessity for healers themselves to seek therapy, with a significant percentage doing so at some point in their careers. Aubrey and I delve into the timeless nature of the therapeutic role and the profound responsibility that comes with supporting others through their darkest times. We also discuss the signs that indicate someone might benefit from therapy, underscoring the importance of connection and the therapeutic alliance.

The episode takes a compassionate turn as we examine professional burnout, vicarious trauma, and their symptoms, such as chronic lateness and hypervigilance. Aubrey offers insights into the systemic changes needed to address these issues, stressing that self-care alone cannot suffice. The conversation concludes with an empowering spotlight on Genesis Women's Shelter and Support, highlighting their pivotal role in combating domestic violence. Listen in to discover strategies for supporting those on the front lines, while also fostering a culture of care and understanding within the mental health profession.

Speaker 1:

Talk therapy is in high demand, but when the therapist needs someone to talk to, who does she call? Licensed professional counselor Aubrey Richardson is here today and shares her practice to help therapists, helping professionals and caregivers recover from people-pleasing, perfectionism and overachieving, without feeling selfish. I'm Maria McMullin and this is Genesis the podcast, and this is Genesis the podcast. Aubrey Richardson is a licensed professional counselor in Texas with a passion for caring for those on the front lines. She graduated from Johns Hopkins University with a clinical mental health counseling degree in 2019.

Speaker 1:

Aubrey has worked at all levels of care at various psychiatric rehabilitation facilities, including inpatient units, partial hospitalization programs, and was the adult intensive outpatient programming coordinator at Texas Health Behavioral Health Dallas. After seeing the effects of burnout and vicarious trauma on fellow clinicians, she pursued opening her private practice. Trauma on fellow clinicians she pursued opening her private practice. Currently, aubrey is the owner and operator of Sage Holistic Counseling and specializes in working with other therapists, helpers and caregivers to recover from perfectionism, people-pleasing and overachieving. She is passionate about helping her therapy seekers holistically address the mind and body as well as challenge the dominant narrative around hustle culture. When Aubrey is not working, she's an active member of Beta Kappa Beta, the Dallas area alumni organization for Alpha Chi Omega sorority and is an active member of the Alliance Board for Genesis Women's Shelter and Support Aubrey. Welcome to the show.

Speaker 2:

Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1:

I'm so excited to be here I am so excited to learn from you today because you and I just met, like just like a week ago I think it's just been a week since we were introduced and we really had a great conversation about the work that we're doing at Genesis and how it, you know, kind of is similar to the work that you're doing in your practice, and we also have in common you and I we figured out that we're recovering people pleasers and maybe perfectionists.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. So if you, listening, are a people pleaser or a perfectionist or an overachiever or you're just stinking tired today, you're in really good company. So listen along as we learn about how a therapist sometimes needs a therapist. I am very intrigued about the work you are doing to support therapists with therapy, because at Genesis we have so many helping professionals, from licensed social workers and professional counselors to advocates, attorneys and so many others, and it's kind of like everyone who works at Genesis is some level of a helping professional. Even if you're not directly working with clients, you're working for the mission that supports them.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely.

Speaker 1:

All of these folks, all of these positions, whether at Genesis or elsewhere, including yourself, do a lot of folks, all of these positions, whether a Genesis or elsewhere, including yourself, do a lot of good, despite all of the trauma that is involved, for the people that they help. So, while it makes sense to me that a therapist might need their own professional to talk with, I'm curious how you got started in this work and who are your typical clients in this work and who are your typical clients?

Speaker 2:

Yes, I always knew that I wanted to be in the therapy space. I just wasn't really quite sure what that was going to look like. In a previous life I actually started out on the research side of things. So I started my journey in research. I was working on a study at Johns Hopkins helping folks with serious mental illness lose weight and quit smoking to improve their cardiovascular risk factors Wow, and I loved sitting in the psych rehab programs. I loved sitting with the folks. I love talking to them and hearing their story and I absolutely despised going back to the office and having to put data into Excel spreadsheets for six hours of my day. So pretty quickly I knew that I needed to shift sides of where I was, so I applied for a master's program. I got into my master's program at Johns Hopkins and had that concentration in clinical mental health counseling. I no longer live in Maryland, so it turns out that the snow is not for me.

Speaker 1:

I'm a native Texan, so I'm not built, yeah me either.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, not built for that weather.

Speaker 2:

And so I came back to Texas and I started working in the inpatient unit Texas and I started working in the inpatient unit personal hospitalization and intensive outpatient programs at Texas Health, dallas here, and I spent a few years working there and I met so many incredible clinicians who were so passionate and so good at what they did and they were so burned out Wow. And I couldn't figure out. I was like, wow, I'm in this totally different state, right, like I'm in a totally different setting and I'm noticing the same thing. There's all these incredible people, highly talented, very capable, so crispy burnt out, wow. And then I started this other job in a private practice. So now I'm in a different setting and I started in this private practice of March 2020.

Speaker 2:

So COVID hit and it was the first time in recent history that therapists and clients were going through the same thing at the same time and there was this influx of folks who were nurses, who were doctors, who were on the front lines, who started coming in either for the first time or returning to therapy. Right, and I was like these are my people, these are people I connect with. I know them, I've been there, I've lived this life and I haven't looked back, since I've just continued to specialize and really hone in on helpers, healers and caregivers. That's amazing.

Speaker 1:

I mean, that really is a kind of a new twist on something coming out of the pandemic that was actually good and helpful to not just to you but to a lot of other people. Let's try to get a baseline definition of what a caregiver is versus a helping professional and so on.

Speaker 2:

To me, the difference between a caregiver and a helping professional is just whether or not this person is paid for their labor. So a caregiver can be someone who is taking care of elderly parents or taking care of small children Maybe their spouse is someone who is chronically ill or going through cancer treatments they're in relationships with someone who is active in their addiction versus a helping professional is someone whose income and livelihood depends on them helping people every day.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I kind of thought that was the distinction, but I wanted just to be really sure what we were talking about. So I don't necessarily have to be a therapist to come and work with you as my therapist, you know, if I'm taking care of an elderly parent and I don't have to be burned out either, right, can just be kind of need someone to help you make sense of things.

Speaker 2:

Yes, most people are going to fall into that category.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so let's talk about the issues that they are facing that are unique to these specific roles.

Speaker 2:

Let's do it. Let's talk about these very unique pain points that therapists points that therapists, healers, helpers, caregivers experience. In my experience, one of the biggest pain points is that their work is fundamentally undervalued. The work is invisible or seen as like oh, this is just part of your personality, this is what you do, this is part of your role, and these are professions that tend to be lower paid for the same or more education than other industries.

Speaker 1:

Right or not paid at all if you're a caregiver.

Speaker 2:

Correct or it's totally unpaid labor that you are providing. There's also this pain point of holding emotional space for other people all day long. You may talk to people all day, eight hours a day, but your job is to keep the focus on the other person and that takes an incredible toll on someone. We're also seeing that the emotional space that we're having to hold are for clients, therapy seekers, who are going through more acute and crisis situations. So people are coming in with more intense symptoms, more severe, just more complex things that are going on and especially if you are this helper, healer, caregiver, there can be this stigma that you should already know what to do, that you should already have all of the answers in your head and you should be able to figure it out by yourself About yourself.

Speaker 2:

Yes, about yourself Right, and it is so untrue that we're supposed to already have all of the answers. But there's that stigma of I don't want to like admit that maybe. I tell other people all day long that they need to take care of themselves, but I have a really hard time taking care of myself.

Speaker 1:

Sure.

Speaker 2:

Something that I'm also noticing and that's gotten more prevalent over time, is having to balance the ever-changing and quickly changing laws with your ethical mandates and the mission of your organization, and trying to balance those things out. A lot of the times, if the laws and the ethics are not aligned, you have to make that ethical decision, you have to use some sort of decision-making model, and you may be in the situation where your license may be jeopardized, right If you break the law. Can you give us an?

Speaker 1:

example.

Speaker 2:

Sure. So if I have a client that comes in and is seeking particular healthcare services that are not allowed in this state, do I report them, as is mandated by Texas law, or do I help them receive those services other places?

Speaker 1:

Wow, I mean, that is, I hadn't even really put that together. But yes, I hear what you're saying, that can be extremely challenging on so many levels.

Speaker 2:

And if your license is your livelihood, if that is tied to your 401k, if that is tied to your savings, your own healthcare, is that something that you're really able to put at risk? Right, you know people have invested significant time and money into getting their licenses Absolutely and having to weigh right those pros and cons of like I don't have that privilege of like yeah, it's okay if they take my license away. You know that's my livelihood.

Speaker 2:

There's also been this whiplash that I've noticed in my folks related to COVID-19, that for so long all of these helpers and healers, healthcare professionals, were seen as like healthcare heroes and now that messaging is totally gone. I was working in the hospital when COVID hit and all of a sudden there was this big sparkly sign outside that said like thank you, healthcare heroes. And people were like dropping off dinners and lunches and gifts from all of these businesses and you're like, oh, wow, like people are really recognizing my contribution and that has gone away so quickly and that leaves folks feeling really confused and really disappointed and really again that the work feels undervalued and not as important with the increased red tape and the bureaucracy of navigating broken systems like healthcare, like insurance, where you're having to do more administrative tasks that don't align with providing any sort of patient care.

Speaker 1:

This is such an undertaking and so necessary it sounds. You know that you or someone needs to be there for people who are always there for others, and I have to wonder then how common is it for a therapist or a helping professional to really need their own therapist?

Speaker 2:

I am so excited to answer this question, oh good, okay, so there's two. There's two pieces that I want to really highlight, and the first is that it's very difficult to capture data on this, but the best estimates are that somewhere between 60 to 80% of folks in the helping professions are in therapy.

Speaker 1:

At one time or another.

Speaker 2:

Sure, yes, at one time or another, but again, it's hard to capture that data.

Speaker 1:

Just privacy, hipaa, stigma, all that sort of contributing factors yeah sure, I didn't think that there was a big study on it, so much as just wondering if it's. You know. We could even look at this on a very hyper local level and say, hey, what's the stream of people coming to your practice? You know what I mean. Are you booked every day?

Speaker 2:

Oh, I am booked. I am full. People need help. Especially after the COVID-19 pandemic, the demand for mental health care has increased at least two and a half times what we were seeing before the pandemic.

Speaker 1:

Oh, absolutely. And beyond the pandemic, the society we live in, the rhetoric that we need to deal with day in and day out, it's enough to make anyone feel like they need someone to talk to.

Speaker 2:

Life is hard and it's only going to get harder.

Speaker 1:

Said the therapist.

Speaker 2:

Said the therapist yeah, absolutely, life is hard. Life is hard and we're not supposed to go through this life by ourselves.

Speaker 1:

We're supposed to be in community. I think it's important to be able to say out loud and just acknowledge life is hard. I think even that can just be a step to say it's hard, this was hard, this day was hard and I can't take it anymore. Whether or not you end up going to talk to a therapist is, you know, a different story. But acknowledging how you feel I think is really important into being honest with yourself and with others.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely 100%.

Speaker 1:

So I mean at Genesis, like I said, we have a lot of professionals working with survivors of domestic violence and I fully understand the need for these professionals and professionals like you as well. I mean, these are really important jobs and they're critical.

Speaker 2:

But learning about the trauma or the business of trauma makes me wonder how these professions can be attractive to anyone when the work can be so hard these professions these helpers, healers, caregivers there are good days at work and there are bad days at work, just like any other job, any other nine to five corporate job. The difference is that our good days and our bad days tend to look very different. Hmm, on our good days, we have the opportunity to see the incredible hope, the incredible resiliency in human beings and the ability for folks to make and sustain change, and that is a beautiful thing that people very few people get to witness. Who is in this business of trauma. You may be the only person in someone's life who gets to hear the full story. They get to know what is really happening, what is really going on for this person in their head and in their heart. It is a gift and a privilege to hear someone's story. Being a therapist is my highest privilege that I've ever experienced and probably will ever experience Therapists and helpers.

Speaker 2:

We are wounded healers ourselves, and so we have this immense capacity to tap into our own experience and offer this deep empathy, to build this relationship with another person that is incredibly healing, that they may have never experienced a safe relationship like this in their life. And this profession of healing, whatever that may look like, has been around across time and space. It's been present in every culture for as long as we know. It just looks different now. Folks have always turned to spiritual advisors. They have turned to shamans. Now therapy just looks very different. Right, it is very professional, it's very structured, but healing has always been happening in our communities. It's been happening for as long as people have been experiencing tough days, which has been as long as you know beginning of time.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think you hit on something else really important there, and that is this sense of community and how healing it can be just to have a connection with another human being and feel that you are part of something larger than yourself or what's happening to you.

Speaker 2:

Yes, the relationship between therapist and therapy seeker. That relationship is the number one determinant of how effective the therapy is going to be. It is more important than the specific modality that you were using. It is all about the relationship that you build.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think I could see that Having a connection with someone is critical to being able to maintain this relationship.

Speaker 2:

We are hurt in relationships and we heal in relationships. You're very wise, Aubrey.

Speaker 1:

Let's talk about when someone should really kind of look up and think about talking to a therapist. What are some of the signs that one might need a therapist?

Speaker 2:

I have many, many blog posts written about this, of when it is time to see a therapist, and there are definitely some signs that you need to look out for in yourself and that, again in community, we should be looking out for in our peers, our coworkers and our friends, Because sometimes we don't necessarily notice what is happening.

Speaker 2:

What we tend to see is that you give too much of yourself and there's just nothing left at the end of the day. Healers and helpers can be emotional sponges and we just take in all of these feelings and thoughts from other people and we give everything that we have and, at the end of the day, we are just exhausted. We are sitting in our cars outside of our homes scrolling on social media before we go inside. We are sitting in the dark, just sitting in the silence, because that's the first time we've had it all day. You know, just sitting in the silence because that's the first time we've had it all day. Yeah, we are tired and that is a really good sign that it is it's time to call a therapist.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think that sounds about right to me, and tired can be just emotionally drained not physically tired.

Speaker 2:

Yes, if you are sleeping seven, eight hours a night and waking up and you're still exhausted, that's not physical exhaustion, that's emotional exhaustion that is really coming through. And we see this guilt of. I quote should be able to give more, I should be able to do more, and we act as if we're super human, and we're not. We are only human beings. We have limits. We can only do so much in a day, and when we start to feel like we're not giving enough, that can be a sign that burnout is looming and again it may be time to call a therapist. I think those are kind of the big, big signs to start looking out for.

Speaker 1:

So I just want to double back and remind people that Aubrey has a great blog on her website and it includes one blog post specifically about the signs that the therapist may need a therapist and it's not scary at all, right, I mean, it's not like red flags. Morning signs, like you know, turn back, now dead end. It is very thoughtfully prepared and I hope you'll go and take a look at it after this show. What is the website, aubrey?

Speaker 2:

It is sageholisticcounselingcom slash shc-blog, and you can see all of my blog posts there.

Speaker 1:

Okay, yeah, it's all really good. I personally have read some of the blogs and I really enjoyed it. So let's say we're in therapy for you know, just dealing with some emotional burnout issues or whatever, and or trying to overcome this overachiever life or career that we've established for ourselves. Is there an end point to therapy or does? Is it continual? What do you typically see?

Speaker 2:

Yes, yes to all things Perfectionism, people-pleasing, overachieving. These tend to be the overt presentations of underlying anxiety and trauma. So there is absolutely a time and a place where someone needs to be in active therapy to take care of themselves, and that may look more like weekly sessions with the therapist, but I'm going to give a little bit of a hot take here.

Speaker 2:

Okay, that I truly believe that if you are a therapist, if you are actively offering healing to another person, then you should be in therapy always. How often you see your therapist, what kind of modality you're doing, what you're talking about may change over time, but I am a true believer that therapists should also be in therapy. So there is no you know end point where it's like ah, today's the day Like I have reached healing, Like there's no more work to do. I, you know I am perfectly healed and, you know, totally recovered from my people pleasing and all of my overachieving. That's not realistic. But there are days where you can say you know what I have reached, like my initial goals, I'm feeling better, I'm ready to take maybe a step back to seeing someone less frequently. But I truly believe that all therapists should be in therapy.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean, I think that's a really interesting take on the whole issue and I think it's a healthy approach. That doesn't mean there aren't other ways to do it that aren't equally as healthy. I think kind of, in a way, what you're saying is put make time for yourself, put yourself first and really just you know kind of make sure that you're okay. It's the whole oxygen mask analogy right, and you really do need to have yours on first before you can ever help anybody else.

Speaker 2:

Doctors, other doctors, when they're sick, chiropractors cannot adjust themselves Right.

Speaker 1:

We have to take care of ourselves. I was just thinking about stylists. They can't really do their own hair. Yeah, you can't cut your own hair. I mean, I know my stylist is. She does not cut her own hair. If you're listening, Kelly, you're the best and you're not allowed to leave me. So okay, let's then talk about something we touched on throughout this conversation so far what is emotional burnout, what are the signs and what steps should we take to manage it?

Speaker 2:

Yes, let's get into it. Okay. So emotional burnout can look like depression and anxiety, but it has this very systemic piece to the burnout. So we love to say you know, individuals have a problem with burnout, but burnout solving, burnout is really about changing the systems, because the system is demanding too much of one person.

Speaker 1:

But I don't know that I fully understand what burnout means.

Speaker 2:

Yes, so burnout is this level where we are too much is going out and not enough is coming in. So we start to see that we are falling behind on tasks. We are maybe chronically late to work and it doesn't have to be. You know, I'm 30 minutes late to work every day but we are showing up later and later over time. We are more cynical, we are more sarcastic, we are not as committed to the things that we used to be really excited and passionate about. We are not experiencing the same level of joy from things that previously brought us joy.

Speaker 2:

We tend to see that folks use more sick days, that they're starting to see more physical manifestations of stress, like headaches, neck aches, stomach aches that may prevent them to coming into work, aches, stomach aches that may prevent them to coming into work. We're seeing anger, frustration and irritability. That is not characteristic of that person and is typically not proportional to whatever is happening. We're seeing that chronic exhaustion where it's not getting better with sleep and rest and we're starting to see more unhelpful coping skills. So, instead of like calling a friend after work, maybe we are spending too much money, maybe we start drinking too much or maybe we start avoiding things. So that's an emotional burnout. It can look like depression and anxiety, but it is related to too many demands on one person.

Speaker 1:

Gotcha, Okay, so you were. Then you were answering the question what are the signs? And I don't think we got to the part about what steps should we take to manage it.

Speaker 2:

Yes. So I want to be so clear that we cannot just self-care our way out of burnout and vicarious trauma. There are things that we can do preventatively to make it less likely to happen and we always want to focus on that prevention over the remediation. So the things that we can do to manage and prevent it are to try to balance our caseload. So if I'm a therapist, it's not going to go very well for me if I am putting eight clients on my schedule back to back, all who are experiencing incredible amounts of, like, active trauma. That's not going to go well for me.

Speaker 2:

Over time, right Scheduling breaks in our day, making sure that we are eating lunch, getting adequate supervision, getting adequate support in case, consultation from our peers and coworkers, being able to set healthy boundaries for ourselves at work and at home, living more of your life outside of work, really focusing on those things that bring you joy and give you that nourishment and rejuvenation that you you know that makes you like, want to get up in the morning and like. I'm excited for this thing. But we also have to focus on the systemic environmental changes. You cannot heal environments that get you sick. So we can do you know all the self-care things. But if we are still trying to see too many clients in a day, it's not going to get better. If we are still trying to navigate, you know there not being enough therapists, you know we can't self-care our way out of a situation where most places are going to be understaffed and underfunded.

Speaker 1:

Yes, I can see that. I think you were really smart to say that we cannot self-care our way out of emotional burnout. It's kind of a turning point or a tipping point, if you will. So if you start seeing those warning signs a little bit earlier or you take action a little bit earlier, maybe you can prevent it going too deeply into the burnout and, you know, work your way back out of it and hopefully address some of that anxiety and depression, because you said something really interesting about how perfectionism is really the underlying depression and anxiety.

Speaker 2:

Yes, it's the overt presentation of the underlying anxiety and trauma.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I find that really interesting because I would have never thought of that I'm not a therapist and I would have never thought that all just anxiety right could cause or manifest in so many different ways that are then so harmful to you as an individual.

Speaker 2:

The things that were really helpful to us when we were in really difficult situations may not be as helpful to us now that we are out of that really difficult or traumatic situation. People-pleasing is another word for fawning, which we know is you know, fight, flight, freeze and fawn. Those are the four things and so that can be really helpful when we're in a traumatic situation, to help keep us safe, to anticipate the reactions of other people.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, exactly when we're not in that situation.

Speaker 2:

It can be way more harmful to us.

Speaker 1:

And I think, as women, a lot of us were raised to be people pleasers.

Speaker 2:

We are socialized to be that way.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we want people to be happy and we want them to be happy with us. I mean, I don't really care if people aren't happy with me.

Speaker 2:

There's that recovering people, pleaser yeah.

Speaker 1:

I'm good. I'm good now. You want to be angry, do it on your own time. But moving on to others, not me. This show is not about me. Let's talk about vicarious trauma. How does that manifest and what are some tools for dealing with it?

Speaker 2:

So vicarious trauma manifests like PTSD post-traumatic stress disorder. Whereas emotional burnout presents closer to anxiety and depression, vicarious trauma is going to present closer to PTSD. What is different about it is that the person who experiences vicarious trauma is not the person who experienced the trauma. So you may still get flashbacks from the event as if you were the one that experienced it. You may have intrusive thoughts and memories or thoughts that you don't want. You're trying not to think about the event. You may have really physical manifestations, like your heart may start to race. You might feel sweaty and clammy. You may have nightmares as the healer and the helper.

Speaker 2:

You may start to avoid any reminders of that trauma. You may feel really detached from people, places and things that you love. You may startle very easy, like if someone comes up behind you. You may have a really large startle reaction, again disproportionate to the situation. You may be hypervigilant, just always scanning the environment, kind of double checking, everything being really overly attuned to the environment. And again you may see that piece of being more irritable and more angry. That just isn't characteristic of that person. And if you are experiencing vicarious trauma, everything we talked about applies right, like the earlier you see it, the better it's going to be in terms of outcome and how long it's going to take to recover from that. But this is a situation that would be pretty severe and I would recommend, if someone is experiencing these PTSD-like symptoms, that they do immediately seek care.

Speaker 1:

That's also good advice. Now we're talking a lot about the negative of being a caregiver or helping professional or a therapist yourself. When you're working with these clients, do they ever discover or rediscover the joys or purpose of their work, despite all the challenges or vicarious trauma?

Speaker 2:

Yes, absolutely. These are like the best days as a, as a therapist, when your clients are like things are so much better and you're like, yes, we have, like, we have done the work. Um, but in my experience I tend to see this more when the environment has changed right. We cannot heal in environments that get us sick Right. So I've had a client who was a nurse in the ICU during COVID, who experienced a lot of vicarious drama and direct trauma, who has now taken a step back from bedside nursing and has shifted into closer to nurse education. Okay, thriving, is able to sleep better, she's more present in her friendships, she is more present in her with her partner, she is not anywhere near as depressed. You know, life is so much different. Yeah, that's amazing and that is such a win when you're like yeah, like you feel better, you're living a life that is more aligned with you and you're able to experience that joy that you haven't felt for a while.

Speaker 1:

You know, that particular example makes me wonder if people are really only intended to be, maybe in those types of really high stress, really intense environment roles for certain periods of their career, maybe not for the lifetime of their career, and you may love it for five years and then it may not be for you anymore because you're just like too overwhelmed with all of the challenges.

Speaker 2:

Realistically, most folks are going to be in these really high acuity situations for about two to three years before they start to experience some level of burnout. And again, sometimes that burnout can be managed really proactively and you can stay in that environment, but not always.

Speaker 1:

That's when you talk to a therapist to find out which direction you should go. Let's talk about you. I want to learn more about you. Let's do it. Do you find, after these six years of doing this work, that you still need a caregiver for your own self, for your own caregiving and for what you are, in order to kind of like rejuvenate what you are able to give to your clients and others?

Speaker 2:

Yes, absolutely so. As a therapist who specializes in seeing, like other therapists, I see my own therapist. It's like my client's grand therapist, is like the joke that I go to see and I see her every week. And I have recently started to do EMDR, which is eye movement, desensitization and reprocessing. I'm a big believer that I cannot ask my folks to do something that I am unwilling to do, so I continue to go to therapy.

Speaker 2:

I continue to do my own healing. I make sure that I take care of the basics in my life, like sleep hygiene. I basically treat myself like I am an emotional houseplant, so I need regular sunlight. I need regular water and food, like very clear intervals. Right, I do hot yoga, as you know. As often as I can, I meditate. I volunteer with causes that are important to me. I'm an active member of the Genesis Alliance board. I I spend a lot of time in consultation groups with my peers. I go to trainings to learn about, you know, what is the newest and the best coolest thing out there. I do things I love. I read a ton. I spend time with my friends, my family. I've gotten into some different hobbies to let my brain rest and use my hands Good, I've recently learned how to play Mahjong. Oh my gosh, okay, okay, it is so cool.

Speaker 1:

It is everywhere. Yes, it is. Yes, it's on everyone's list, right?

Speaker 2:

It's everyone's list, and because I was busy working in the hospitals during COVID, I am just now getting into my sourdough era, so many people are doing this too. So I you know I'm a little behind the times, but you know I'm doing what I can. But you know what? I'm? A recovering people pleaser. I'm a recovering perfectionist. There are some days that I'm really good at like setting those boundaries and saying no when I mean no and yes when I mean yes. Um, but at the end of the day, I am still just a messy human like everyone else, um, who has really good days and really bad days of trying to make decisions that are most aligned with what's important to me. So, absolutely, I am a caregiver that still needs a caregiver 100%.

Speaker 1:

I've asked other therapists this and I'm curious how you would respond to it. Do you ever feel frustrated with the choices that your clients make?

Speaker 2:

I think sometimes my initial reaction is to be a little frustrated, and I recognize that this person knows their life way better than I know it. This person has every ability to make really good decisions for themselves and even if they end up making a decision that turns out to be a mistake, they also have the innate capacity to recover from that mistake. And I have so much faith and trust in that that if I am frustrated with a choice my client is making, that's a me thing, that's something I need to look at and then I need to you know, examine further, like, why am I getting really frustrated with this person? Um, but I think it's very normal, right, Like we have such deep relationships with our clients and you're like, oh, like I wish, like I wish you would make this choice, Uh, and I fully trust in my client's ability to change and make really good decisions for themselves.

Speaker 1:

Sure, okay, I'm really glad you provided that insight. So for anybody listening who is a therapist or a helping professional and is considering seeking out some support for themselves, let's give them an idea of how common burnout can be and that way they can kind of gauge for themselves if they want to, you know, pursue at least just looking into getting their own therapist.

Speaker 2:

In 2023, there was a therapist wellbeing report published by Simple Practice, and Simple Practice is one of the largest electronic medical health systems designed for therapists. So they asked 550 US-based therapists all of these different questions, and the results are wild. So 52% of therapists reported experiencing burnout in 2023, with 29% reporting that they currently felt burned out At that moment in time. At that moment in time and still working. Still working, okay. 54% talked about compassion fatigue as a reason for their burnout.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, nearly half cited low pay. One third said that the severity and complexity of their client's needs has increased. 25% said that their caseload was too high. Over 50% closer to 60% said that the work-life balance was a contributor to their burnout. And half of the people who said that they are experiencing burnout reported that it makes them more cynical and more hesitant to take on more severe, complex and acute clients. And here's the wild part Nearly a third of people in this survey said that they considered leaving the field or are currently considering leaving the field. Since COVID, there has been a two and a half times demand at least for mental health care services, and if too many folks are getting burned out, they will leave the field. And we are already facing a shortage of mental health practitioners, of people who are able to provide that healing, caregiving and helping.

Speaker 1:

So where do we go from here? Where do?

Speaker 2:

we go.

Speaker 2:

Folks who provide this helping and healing deserve to live this life that is full, authentic and joyful, that recognizes the contribution of what they do.

Speaker 2:

But they are also so much more than just what they do and this is so important to make sure that they are okay, because if our helpers and healers say that they are feeling more cynical, that they're not able to be fully present, that their burnout is affecting their quality of care, there are clients, there are folks out there who need healing, who need help, who aren't going to get it, and we already know there are not enough therapists who provide services to people of color.

Speaker 2:

Right, we already know that there is a shortage and it is only going to get worse if left unattended. Again, I think it's important to just note that these things are happening right, like acknowledging all parts of the experience, like, yes, there are these really beautiful, wonderful days as a therapist, and also there are some really hard days. Like there are some days where you are totally burned out and it feels really difficult and that's a very common experience, and talking about that experience with your peers, with your coworkers, makes it more normalized. Right, it's not a you issue. There is one person cannot provide right all the help and support of a mental health care system that says we need more clinicians. Their presence is so needed, right Like we need these folks, and also we can't ask them to try to fix a broken system on an individual level.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's for sure. I think that there's a need for more therapists. I think there's a need for a greater sense of unity around the world, really, and I think it would only help us to build communities of help and hope and support so that we have a better sense of where of that we belong in the place where we are. You know, either it's our workplace or it is our neighborhood or our church or some other organization, and I think that it's, I think, what you, what you were talking about, what you kind of like do for yourself learning a hobby and going to yoga and stuff like that. It may sound silly, but those things can help prevent some levels of burnout.

Speaker 2:

It is so seemingly simple, and yet it is the simple things that make the biggest impact.

Speaker 1:

That is the truth. What is your website again, so people can learn more, read that blog and get in touch with you.

Speaker 2:

Yes, my website is wwwsageholisticcounselingcom.

Speaker 1:

Aubrey, good to be with you. Thank you so much.

Speaker 2:

Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1:

Genesis Women's Shelter and Support exists to give women in abusive situations a way out. We are committed to our mission of providing safety, shelter and support for women and children who have experienced domestic violence and to raise awareness regarding its cause, prevalence and impact. Join us in creating a societal shift on how people think about domestic violence. You can learn more at GenesisShelterorg and when you follow us on social media on Facebook and Instagram at Genesis Women's Shelter, and on X at Genesis Shelter. The Genesis Helpline is available 24 hours a day, seven days a week, by call or text at 214-946-HELP 214-946-4357.