
Genesis The Podcast
Genesis the Podcast is a new way to connect with Genesis Women’s Shelter and Support and expand your thinking about domestic violence and related issues that affect women. GTP is also a trusted source of information if you are in an abusive relationship and need safety, shelter or support. Listen every week for fresh content related to domestic violence, to connect with world-renown professionals, participate in exclusive events and training opportunities, and take action against domestic violence.
Genesis The Podcast is hosted by Maria MacMullin, Chief Impact Officer of Genesis Women's Shelter & Support and the Host of the Podcast on Crimes Against Women.
About Genesis Women's Shelter & Support - Located in Dallas, Texas, Genesis provides safety, shelter and support for women who have experienced domestic violence, and raises awareness regarding its cause, prevalence and impact. Learn more at GenesisShelter.org
Genesis The Podcast
Stealthing: One Survivor's Story
When Lynn Stroud was 20 years old, her boyfriend deliberately violated their agreed-upon method of contraception following a birth control failure. His casual dismissal – claiming he "forgot" and was "drunk" – masked a calculated attempt to trap her through pregnancy. What followed was a harrowing journey through reproductive coercion, a form of intimate partner violence that remains largely invisible despite affecting a quarter of domestic violence survivors.
Lynn's powerful testimony takes us through the red flags she missed, the isolation she felt when facing an unwanted pregnancy while her partner pressured her toward marriage, and the trauma of seeking care without support. Her boyfriend's refusal to help – financially, emotionally, or logistically – underscores the complex dynamics of reproductive coercion. This wasn't merely about pregnancy; it was about control, power, and the systematic dismantling of her autonomy. The relationship later escalated into stalking, intimidation, and further abuse that continued for years.
Today, Lynn channels her painful experiences into education and advocacy. She helps survivors recognize the warning signs of reproductive coercion: pressure and guilt around pregnancy decisions, unreasonable excuses to avoid contraception, and threats related to reproductive choices. While legal protections remain woefully inadequate – only four U.S. states have specific laws addressing even one form of reproductive coercion (stealthing) – Lynn's advocacy points toward a future where survivors have both voice and recourse. Her message resonates powerfully in our current climate, where reproductive rights face significant challenges and the conversation around consent continues to evolve. By sharing her story, Lynn offers both validation for survivors and a blueprint for change in how we understand, discuss, and address this hidden form of abuse.
My guest today is Lynn Stroud, a survivor leader with lived experience of reproductive coercion, domestic abuse and sexual assault. She joins us to tell her story with the intention of educating listeners and empowering survivors. I'm Maria McMullin and this is Genesis, the podcast. Lynn Stroud has endured multiple forms of gender-based violence and today uses her voice to cultivate both a trauma-informed mindset and increased legal remedies for victims. In doing so, she advocates for listening without judgment, validating survivors' experiences and recognizing the resilience that often emerges from adversity. That often emerges from adversity. Her insights paint a picture of transformational potential, where institutions and communities can become healing spaces rather than inadvertently perpetuating harm.
Speaker 1:The following episode discusses sexual violence. Lynn, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. It's good to be with you. I've learned a lot about your story over the past couple of months and it contains many elements and instances of abuse, and I'm really grateful that you are here to talk with us about what happened to you, as well as the ways you are working as a leader in the anti-violence movement. I'd like to focus on reproductive coercion, because that's an area that's really important to you. Can you help us define that term and identify the common types of reproductive coercion?
Speaker 2:Sure. So reproductive coercion is a form of power and control, because one partner takes away reproductive health decisions and options from the other. And I can provide some examples of that. Reprodu reproductive coercion could include refusing to use a condom or other type of birth control. Breaking or removing a condom during intercourse, which is also known as stealthing. Forcing a partner to get an abortion or preventing them from getting an abortion. Threatening to tell their family or their friends or expose them somehow to law enforcement about seeking an abortion. Withholding finances needing to purchase birth control, which is also a form of financial abuse. Also threatening their partner or becoming violent if they don't follow their wishes to either end or continue a pregnancy. And another example is not following through with an agreed type of birth control. So, for example, if the two of you have agreed that you're going to use the pullout method and at the last moment, one partner decides that they're going to take it upon themselves to not follow through with that agreement, that is also reproductive coercion.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean it's a lot to unpack, right, because we don't hear this topic very often, and it also has a lot to do with consent.
Speaker 2:It really does.
Speaker 1:So partners can consent in advance and then just not follow through with it? And can you also give us some like examples or signs of how this plays out or what people should look for if they're in a relationship?
Speaker 2:So reproductive coercion. Some of the red flags that you might notice in a relationship would be various types of pressure and guilt and shame coming from the perpetrator. There could be instances where the one partner is trying to pressure the other one into having children. They may also use cultural pressure, religious pressure. They also might threaten to leave the relationship if the abused partner doesn't follow through with what they want. Another sign and this happened to me personally was if, from the beginning, the male in the relationship makes numerous excuses for not using a condom and they're unreasonable excuses, like I just don't like the way they feel or they affect my performance, or things like that. Those are definite red flags.
Speaker 1:Interesting, so a lot of the information that we're talking about. In addition to those examples we pulled from the hotlineorg, which is the National Domestic Violence Hotline website, they do have information, including statistics, that state the hotline and partners in 2011 found that 25% of people who contacted the hotline reported experiencing reproductive coercion. Contacted the hotline reported experiencing reproductive coercion. Preliminary data from 2021 shows that 1,526 individuals who contacted the hotline also reported reproductive coercion, showing that this is an issue many people continue to face, so it can affect anyone. The hotline indicates that specific communities may face added barriers to receiving care and support, and I can only imagine that those are women of color, people for whom English is not their first language if they're living in the United States, and other communities that are impoverished, underprivileged or otherwise oppressed. Now you have been very open about your experiences of abuse, in particular, being subjected to reproductive coercion. Lynn, what happened to you?
Speaker 2:So my story begins over 20 years ago and I think at that time, if you would have even mentioned the term reproductive coercion or even coercive control, I don't think anyone would have understood quite what you were talking about, right? So I was in my early 20s, in fact, when I met the man that I was dating. I was 20. And he was a lot older than me. He was 27. And when I first met him, my thinking was that, you know, I had only dated men my own age up until that point, and I thought that having a partner who was older would mean that I would be bringing someone in my life who was more mature and steady in their career and could treat me better. And I noticed very quickly that there were a lot of red flags surrounding this person. They were extremely jealous, controlling. Lot of red flags surrounding this person. They were extremely jealous, controlling. They would demand things from me and when I didn't want to do those things, they would either shame me for not wanting to do them or, if I agreed to do them and I enjoyed them, then they would insult me, use terms like you're a slut or you're a whore, things like that.
Speaker 2:A few months into the relationship. I had actually been on birth control for a couple of years. I started the pill when I was 18. And I had gone to my annual checkup with my gyno and she said to me hey, there's this new thing on the market. It's really great for a young woman on the go, so you don't have to remember to take the pill every day. It's this patch, this birth control patch, and you can stick it on and you can keep it on for a week and it stays on in the shower. You don't have to worry about it. It's super convenient. And so I said, okay, that sounds really great and I started taking the patch. Apparently, no one had tested this patch out in ocean water, because I went on vacation in Aruba and the patch immediately came off the minute that I hit the water. Oh, wow. So now I had. Plus, I was in another country, so I had no way of getting a backup method.
Speaker 2:So when I returned from vacation, I was speaking to my much older boyfriend at the time and I said to him the patch came off in the water and you and I need to be incredibly careful right now. So we need to come up with a plan of what we're going to do. And we agreed and decided that we would go forward with having sex but that he would pull out, and I trusted that he would do it. So later that evening we're having sex and the time comes. In fact, I'm actually I reminded him several times during the act hey, don't forget, you need to pull out.
Speaker 2:And this is a 20-year-old young woman reminding a 27-year-old man, and he's getting irritated with me every time I say it. And finally we hit the end and he finishes and he does not pull out. And he was on top of me. I mean, it happened so fast I don't think there would have been time for me to push him off, but it would have been physically impossible for me to push him off or fight him off. So after that happened, I immediately turned to him and went into a state of shock and said what the hell did you just do? And he just, very blunt and with zero emotion, just said I'm sorry, I forgot, I was drunk.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:Wow yeah. And so at that point in time I didn't feel comfortable enough to tell my parents that I was concerned. I was too embarrassed and ashamed to go to them for help. I do believe that at that time this was in the early 2000s. So I believe that Plan B was available, but I believe it was only available with a prescription. I don't think Plan B became available over the counter until several years later, like maybe 2006 or something like that. So I would have been too terrified to call my gynecologist. I had the same gynecologist as my mother, so I would have been terrified at that age that she would have said something in passing and my mother would have found out, despite HIPAA laws. And so he keeps saying don't worry, it was only once, I'm sure you're fine.
Speaker 2:A couple of weeks later, my period was late. I took a pregnancy test. It came back positive and I called him up on the phone. He was out of state training for a job and I said I'm pregnant, what are we going to do? And just very flippant, and again with zero emotion, just said oh okay, well, let's just get married. And I thought we've only been dating for four or five months you don't know me well enough and his response was well, I know enough, let's just get married, let's just have the baby. And by the time I had figured out that I was pregnant, I was 21.
Speaker 2:I was in the middle of college. I hadn't gotten my bachelor's degree yet. I was a singer at the time. I was auditioning to prepare to have this big singing audition so that I could get into this music program. I didn't have a side job. I think I was bartending at the time. I didn't have my own health insurance. I mean, I was basically in no way emotionally ready at a point in my life where I wanted to become a mother. And even more so, I had real concerns about this man after everything that had gone down and about how insensitive he was being to the situation and that he had never offered an apology or any kind of support, and so I felt pretty much alone. He kept trying to pressure me into following through with the pregnancy and marrying him and having the child. I knew that I was in no way ready.
Speaker 2:I ended up going to a Planned Parenthood. I resided in Northern New Jersey at the time, so, luckily for me, it was not difficult then to get some assistance. They ended up giving me another pregnancy test to confirm and gave me two options. They told me that I could take the abortion pill, or they told me that I could have a DNC. But they told me that if I took the abortion pill, that the abortion could end up not being entirely complete. And I didn't want to take the chance. I didn't want to elongate, I didn't want to push this out any further and so I went ahead and scheduled the DNC.
Speaker 2:When I turned and told my boyfriend that this was my decision, that I wanted him to go with me, and actually at that time in New Jersey, in order to have that procedure, you'd have to be under general anesthesia, so you had to have someone drive you to the clinic and stay there with you to be there to drive you home.
Speaker 2:My boyfriend refused. He refused to come with me to the appointment, he refused to have anything to do with it and he refused to pay for it. Wow, and they only accepted cash, and it was about $400. So I gathered up all the money that I had, I called a friend and that friend took me to the clinic, and the only thing that did surprise me at the time was there were two protesters out front. I did not expect to see that, I think in Northern New Jersey I just assumed you know it's a more liberal state, you know I'm not going to have to deal with anything like that. But there were two protesters out front screaming at women as they were entering the clinic. They were screaming things like it's not too late to change your mind, you know, just making them feel absolutely horrible.
Speaker 1:Because you didn't feel horrible already. I mean, it was already such a difficult situation for you.
Speaker 2:Right as if. As if it's not, you know, people treat it like it's such an easy decision.
Speaker 2:And even though I was very concrete, that I knew that this was the right decision for me at that time in my life. In no way is it emotionally or psychologically easy, in any means. It's not something simple to go through and it was basically put me through an unnecessary surgery, and so I did go through with the procedure and after that my relationship with that man took a turn from maybe seeing some red flags to outright abusive, because he was so outraged that I had gone through with the abortion and that I didn't. Basically that he didn't get to trap me and I stayed with him for another, I'd say four years.
Speaker 2:After that we broke up many times because I kept trying to get away from him and every time I did he would stalk me, he would intimidate me, he would intimidate my friends. One time he even broke into my house in the middle of the night and ended up in my bedroom standing over me, which was terrifying. But I realized after several years, after some of the comments that he was making and some of the behaviors that I was seeing from him, that getting me pregnant was absolutely never an accident. It was intentional. He wanted me pregnant, he wanted me trapped.
Speaker 1:That's an incredible story and first and foremost, thank you for sharing that with us. And also, I mean I just want to express I'm really sorry you had to endure all of that. It's very painful. I can hear it just in the retelling that you know, no, it wasn't an easy decision for you to make by any means to go through with that type of procedure and you know it's clearly had an effect on you and just the retelling of the story. It's clearly had an effect on you and just the retelling of the story. It's very emotional and I appreciate you, you know, wanting to just go over the details of that again so that our listeners can learn from your story and your experience of not just reproductive coercion. It sounds like a whole lot of other intimate partner violence coercion.
Speaker 2:it sounds like a whole lot of other intimate partner violence, thank you. Now I would hope that in sharing all of the subtle signs and also the things that are more obvious and may now currently fall under the definition of reproductive coercion, my goal is to raise awareness for something that I don't think many people even know exists.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would have to agree with that. It's not really a popular topic, right? We don't hear it much in the media, probably not at all, unless you go looking for it. You may not know any information about it, but in your case, was there ever the opportunity to expose his actions and his abuse, and were there any consequences or justice in your case?
Speaker 2:Unfortunately. No, I never was able to get any kind of legal justice in those terms. I did communicate with someone in New Jersey. I want to say it was about a year ago and it was really only then that I was able to take so much of the blame off of myself and really put it on him, Because for all those years and really put it on him, Because for all those years and we're talking over 20 years of my life I put so much of the blame on myself and I kept saying that I let that happen to me, not that he did that to me, and so it took a long time for me to come to terms with it. And in the last year to two years I've been able to completely redirect my thinking and when I did speak to someone in New Jersey about the potential of pursuing it, Do you mean legally?
Speaker 1:Yes, legally.
Speaker 2:They basically said that it would not be a very strong case because at this point in time I don't even know if there would be any physical evidence of anything that went on. I wouldn't know how long abortion clinics would keep medical records, but I would seriously doubt that it would be 20 years or over 20 years, and even then it would end up being my word against his. And in saying all this, this is not to discourage anyone. So I don't want anyone to listen to what I'm saying and become discouraged and feel like they shouldn't pursue justice. I think it's absolutely worth a phone call. It's worth looking into different laws and statutes to see what remedies could be available to you In my situation. This what I'm doing right now, this is my form of justice. This what I'm doing right now.
Speaker 1:this is my form of justice speaking out about it, owning the truth sharing the narrative so that no other woman ever has to go through what I went through. Well, I mean, it's an amazing thing that you are doing by sharing the story, because it is such a painful, difficult situation, but, as we learned from the statistics that we mentioned earlier, it's really not uncommon, and that's what is extremely disturbing about the situation. What about systemic failures? I mean, at the time of your case, there was nothing really to pursue or you weren't in the mindset of looking for a way to pursue justice for it. But today this is a different environment. In the past decade at least, it's become very different, especially since the Me Too movement.
Speaker 1:People are talking about sexual harassment and sexual abuse much more openly in social media and in the media, and most recently, very recently, just within the past few years, there has been some movement in the United States and in the UK to criminalize reproductive coercion. For example, the UK has recently convicted and sentenced a few offenders of stealthing, and just this week here in the States, in Minnesota, a bill was brought to the state Senate that would allow victims to bring a civil suit against the accused in cases of stealthing. So while the legislation that's in development in the United States does not go as far as criminalizing the behavior, it does expand the conversation around consent. I'd love to hear your thoughts about the current legislation here and abroad and what can be done to better support victims of stealthing.
Speaker 2:So here in the US, as of January of this year, there are four states that currently have laws addressing stealthing specifically, and that would be California, maine, vermont and Washington. So the unfortunate part, as you mentioned, is that it's not addressed as a crime in any of those states. You would need to bring a civil suit. There is an upside to that in that when you have something brought to court as a crime, you would need to hit that burden of proof, need to hit that burden of proof, whereas in a civil case you might be able to hit that a lot easier. So that is one upside, but unfortunately, if you're dealing with something that's only a civil issue, the punishment for the crime may be a lot less or it may be something that you're not really looking for.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I guess, for example, it could be paying punitive damages to the victim if they're found liable for the accusations against you, but it does not then prevent you from committing those types of offenses again. It does nothing to address the behavior in a concrete and clear way to prevent other crimes, which I can only assume that this is a pattern for an individual who has done this maybe before may do it again or may do something worse.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I know that several years into the relationship with that same man I found out that he did get another woman pregnant before me, that he had been in a relationship with another woman and that she had gotten pregnant. I don't know the details of how, but hearing something like that goes to your point that it absolutely is a pattern of behavior and that goes right into coercive control. And I think what some of these states, at least here in the US, could do is they could amend their civil and criminal statutes to make not only stealthing but reproductive coercion in general a punishable offense, because we just don't have that right now. I think the only way that someone could pursue it in any of those states other than the four that I mentioned would be trying to argue it from a sexual assault standpoint and hoping for some kind of criminal punishment or addressing it in a state that has a coercive control law.
Speaker 1:Which is also very limited because there aren't that many, but in the UK they are identifying stealthing now as a form of rape, and so they've been able to develop legislation that criminalizes the behavior. And actually there's a you know, kind of well-known case I think it was in Scotland where they put this guy away for 16 years for multiple offenses of stealthing, which is kind of remarkable and disturbing as well stealthing in Australia.
Speaker 2:in several states. Stealthing is now illegal in New South Wales, victoria, queensland, tasmania and South Australia.
Speaker 1:And it's criminalized.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Okay, that's good. Those are good examples. Anybody who's listening can go, you know, just look it up on the internet to find out what is the legislation in your state or in your country, because we are heard around the world. This podcast has an international following, so lots of people will be impacted by this type of information. On this topic, let's turn our attention to your work with other survivors. Tell us about how you support other survivors and educate about reproductive coercion. What are you working on?
Speaker 2:I began my journey by training and volunteering with a local domestic abuse advocate organization here in Central Texas, where I work now. They are called Hope Alliance and they not only help victims of domestic abuse but also sexual assault, and so I think that began my journey. I've also been aective, and for the past year I've done, I want to say, at least 10, if not more, podcasts and also some online interviews where I've shared my story of reproductive coercion, and in doing that, some of the feedback that either the podcast hosts or that I've gotten myself is that many victims are getting sort of those aha moments. They're sort of questioning it themselves, similar to the way that I did for many, many years. Is this behavior typical, is this behavior okay? And so my hope is that, in doing these various trainings and hoping to lift up survivors and bring awareness so that we can somehow increase the knowledge and also increase the available punishment that is around this type of behavior.
Speaker 1:That's quite the undertaking for an individual. I think that it's very admirable for you to take up this cause and I also think that it's critically important to the people that it supports. Right, Because you're an expert, you're a Survivors are the experts, and so I think you can be, you know, lend a really valuable voice to the conversation and hopefully move things forward. I'm curious, as both a survivor and an expert in this lived experience of reproductive coercion, if you have a specific call to action for survivors, advocates, law enforcement or others for survivors, advocates, law enforcement or others.
Speaker 2:My goal in all of this is to encourage other women to not only become quite introspective of their own relationships and that, hopefully, that everything that has gone on, not only in the past couple of years with Roe v Wade being dialed back, but also in witnessing our government dial back on many things and we're seeing a dial back on women's rights, on LGBTQ rights I think it's so important for victims and women specifically, to own their narrative, to share their story in as many ways as they see comfortable, and you can share your story anonymously so that you can do it in a way where you feel safe.
Speaker 2:I definitely started out that way, although I reached a point in my journey where I felt like I really wanted to own this as part of who I am, I don't feel any shame about it anymore. That's been a very, very difficult process for me, so I encourage anyone who also has the ear of local law enforcement or congressional relationships or does any type of lobbying or anything like that does any advocacy work. I sincerely encourage those people to listen to the stories of survivors people who have actually lived through this and try to make a real effort to increase the laws and to better narrow the laws so that we have more protection from things like this.
Speaker 1:I think that's a great goal. I think that it's going to require many people who are listening to these stories to take the time to get a deeper understanding of what is happening in these intimate partner relationships, where there is coercive control and then thereby reproductive coercion. I think you're spot on about that and I really appreciate the time you spent with us and hearing your story and your bravery in telling it, and I thank you for being here.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much, Maria.
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